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This post has been edited by BainIhrno: 09 July 2009 - 11:28 AM
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The Za-Khazi Run 5.30 (8.9/1.6)
#1
Jewels 
- Skribbane Smuggler
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Posted 14 March 2008 - 10:50 AM
The Za-Khazi Run is the third of three scenarios, designed by Jeff Vogel, that come with the editor.
Rubies are red,
Sapphires are blue,
But there's not a gem
That's as precious as you.
Sapphires are blue,
But there's not a gem
That's as precious as you.
MultiQuote#2 Alcritas
Posted 25 March 2008 - 03:38 PM
Okay this scenario = bad bad bad. Let me tell you why - everyone plays Valley of the Dying Things first. Then, because most people only have the one party, that's low level, they take it into A Small Rebellion. It's a huge step up quality wise, they get intrigued, they like the game. Then they load Za-Khazi, and many are never heard from again. 4.8
#3 Stareye
Posted 25 March 2008 - 03:38 PM
The Za-Khazi Run was really just a bunch of mini-plots strung together to justify some wilderness guantlet. There were a couple neat things here and there, but nothing really stood out.
The scenario had a time limit but gave no sense of urgency. In fact, I've never had a problem with the time limit even if I wander and explore. I actually had to try to let the time expire. If the time limit would have been more stringent, the scenario would have given a sense of urgency. Do I explore down this tunnel for treasure, or do I proceed forward? As it stands, you never have to make such decisions as there is ample time for both.
Overall, the experience was pretty bland. The motives of the parties involved seemed contrived and unoriginal. The dungeon design was interesting, but sub-par. And the worst part, it definitely had potential -- the plot idea was original. However, Jeff failed greatly to flesh the thing out. And as a professional game designer, that is not very good. As far as scenarios go, this one is far below average. Not the worst, but many have been better.
My Score: 2.8
The scenario had a time limit but gave no sense of urgency. In fact, I've never had a problem with the time limit even if I wander and explore. I actually had to try to let the time expire. If the time limit would have been more stringent, the scenario would have given a sense of urgency. Do I explore down this tunnel for treasure, or do I proceed forward? As it stands, you never have to make such decisions as there is ample time for both.
Overall, the experience was pretty bland. The motives of the parties involved seemed contrived and unoriginal. The dungeon design was interesting, but sub-par. And the worst part, it definitely had potential -- the plot idea was original. However, Jeff failed greatly to flesh the thing out. And as a professional game designer, that is not very good. As far as scenarios go, this one is far below average. Not the worst, but many have been better.
My Score: 2.8
#5 Bob the Impaler
Posted 25 March 2008 - 03:39 PM
The coding would be fairly good for a first effort, although I think you might construe the Vahnatai tomb as if not an illogic puzzle, unjustified.
The plot was horrible and some of it was merely done to squeeze an extra dungeon in. The Trogs are a prime example.
3.5
The plot was horrible and some of it was merely done to squeeze an extra dungeon in. The Trogs are a prime example.
3.5
#7 ???
Posted 25 March 2008 - 03:39 PM
(Bruce)
Poor
I admit it - I didn't make the time limit in my first couple of attempts. The time limit idea is good but the content of the gauntlet is poor. I'd like to see another one like this where the gauntlet is of great quality. A let-down after A Small Rebellion. 4.
Poor
I admit it - I didn't make the time limit in my first couple of attempts. The time limit idea is good but the content of the gauntlet is poor. I'd like to see another one like this where the gauntlet is of great quality. A let-down after A Small Rebellion. 4.
#8 ???
Posted 25 March 2008 - 03:39 PM
(Drakefyre)
You never made the time limit? The first time I played, I finished in 11 days.
4
As I was playing this on the day I registered BoE, I remember scratching my head and wondering - what is the point of all this? The crazy crypt just ruined it for me, as did the unicorns.
You never made the time limit? The first time I played, I finished in 11 days.
4
As I was playing this on the day I registered BoE, I remember scratching my head and wondering - what is the point of all this? The crazy crypt just ruined it for me, as did the unicorns.
#10 miluk
Posted 25 March 2008 - 03:40 PM
8.3
In my opinion, it was solid, like all Jeff Vogel's scenarios and games. The treasures are scattered in a very balanced way and the combat was just right for me. The dialogue is OK. There are no bugs or errors in grammar. All of this is very, very important for my playing experience. What I didn't like was the time limit (in fact, I rarely like any time limits in games). I also didn't get through the scenario in time, I tried twice. I didn't like being forced to go on and not return. But I value solidness.
In my opinion, it was solid, like all Jeff Vogel's scenarios and games. The treasures are scattered in a very balanced way and the combat was just right for me. The dialogue is OK. There are no bugs or errors in grammar. All of this is very, very important for my playing experience. What I didn't like was the time limit (in fact, I rarely like any time limits in games). I also didn't get through the scenario in time, I tried twice. I didn't like being forced to go on and not return. But I value solidness.
#11 ???
Posted 25 March 2008 - 03:41 PM
(eliminsterone)
6.2
ok imho i liked it but please note i was useing a single man party, a fighter / priest with a bit of mage but not well developed at that time char was round 35-45, but being i was very limited on mana for spells (and not having seperate chars each with mana) it took me a bit longer than the average person
but if i were to play through it with an actual party i would have been quite disappointed :-S and compaired to the rewards from mild rebellion i felt that it was a bit unbalanced there, you would expect quite a better reward in a quest thats supposed to be harder (ok player made senarios is 1 thing but these are made by the same person and come together) although i could run through it more than once
bah starting to sound like im writing a book here eh? anyway 7.5 for a single player char, and 4.8 for a large party so im guessing.... thats a 6.2 (rounding up)
and some people may consider this a bit unbalanced well i do too in the beginning, considering theres free gold sitting in the adventurer supplies (ok these should be set near the boats and locked till you accept the mission) and the wizard and priest sell those spells (see above) i really think the spells should be at the liches castle instead, sigh... but that would be unbfair to adventurers coming from the first scenario and buying the spells then going to mild rebellion a little extra prepaired.... ok ill just end here i could go on a while and nobody wants to see that...
6.2
ok imho i liked it but please note i was useing a single man party, a fighter / priest with a bit of mage but not well developed at that time char was round 35-45, but being i was very limited on mana for spells (and not having seperate chars each with mana) it took me a bit longer than the average person
but if i were to play through it with an actual party i would have been quite disappointed :-S and compaired to the rewards from mild rebellion i felt that it was a bit unbalanced there, you would expect quite a better reward in a quest thats supposed to be harder (ok player made senarios is 1 thing but these are made by the same person and come together) although i could run through it more than once
bah starting to sound like im writing a book here eh? anyway 7.5 for a single player char, and 4.8 for a large party so im guessing.... thats a 6.2 (rounding up)
and some people may consider this a bit unbalanced well i do too in the beginning, considering theres free gold sitting in the adventurer supplies (ok these should be set near the boats and locked till you accept the mission) and the wizard and priest sell those spells (see above) i really think the spells should be at the liches castle instead, sigh... but that would be unbfair to adventurers coming from the first scenario and buying the spells then going to mild rebellion a little extra prepaired.... ok ill just end here i could go on a while and nobody wants to see that...
#12 Drizzt
Posted 25 March 2008 - 03:42 PM
I wouldn't accuse it of being a very good scenario, but I don't think it's as bad as some let on here. I liked the cave gauntlet idea, even if it was too easy to finish. Puzzles and various characters seem more random, slap-together-some-stuffish than any sort of cohesive story, but I've seen worse. 5.5
#13 ???
Posted 25 March 2008 - 03:42 PM
(Dragyn Bob)
I didn't really ever get the point of this scenario. The little mandatory miniquests were kind of odd, and didn't really belong, it seemed. I agree, the 'plot' of this scenario was just an excuse to go through a bunch of pointless little miniquests. Meh, I'll give it a 3.
I didn't really ever get the point of this scenario. The little mandatory miniquests were kind of odd, and didn't really belong, it seemed. I agree, the 'plot' of this scenario was just an excuse to go through a bunch of pointless little miniquests. Meh, I'll give it a 3.
#16 Gizmo
Posted 25 March 2008 - 04:00 PM
7.2
I didn't rate this scenario against Jeff's other scenarios, nor did I adjust my rating just because the author is Jeff. Just as a scenario. It has a decent plot, decent puzzles, decent combat... and I do believe it's pretty much bug free. It's a decent scenario.
I didn't rate this scenario against Jeff's other scenarios, nor did I adjust my rating just because the author is Jeff. Just as a scenario. It has a decent plot, decent puzzles, decent combat... and I do believe it's pretty much bug free. It's a decent scenario.
#21 The Almighty Doer of Stuff
Posted 25 March 2008 - 04:04 PM
I'm posting this here for now, despite the instability of The Lyceum. I'll repost it on The Blades Forge when the review system there is up and running.
"The Za-Khazi Run" is a vastly underrated scenario. The reviews it tends to get seem to be like listening to Dire Straits and complaining that you can't mosh and headbang to it. The most active members of this community seem to want story and characters first and foremost, so when they see this scenario has only small traces of either, especially following A Small Rebellion which was heavy on story and characters, they blast it fiercely and frequently, probably scaring away many players who actually enjoy and perhaps would even produce scenarios like this. I feel it doesn't get a fair chance for what it is: a scenario based around exploring a scarcely explored cavern with new and unusual places.
I feel Stareye's observation in his review is backwards. This scenario isn't "a bunch of miniplots strung together to justify some wilderness gauntlet"; rather, the wilderness gauntlet and the simple mission are there mostly to justify the mini-plots, and to unify them into one scenario that can take a party from High to Very High level instead of having ten little scenarios that don't make sense without the context of the unexplored, dangerous territory. Furthermore, the time limit isn't meant to be terribly restrictive. If it were so restrictive that you had to skip half the scenario, you'd miss out on half the scenario with little justifiable reason. It's tight enough to worry the really lousy players who rest in dungeons and backtrack six sections to get things they missed (HINT: don't do that) and that's all it really needs to do.
The puzzles are interesting, clever and quite justified. They either serve to keep people out (why do undead need to get in and out of a crypt easily?) or as a right of passage (you know there are some incredibly wierd ones even in the real world, so I thought it was believable). Also, the headbashing was slightly excessive. It was worked into an interesting puzzle, but the most of time it was annoying. I had to use Magic Map once to figure out how to proceed.
Combat is typical 90s Vogel fare: mindlessly easy hack'n'slash. It wasn't challenging, but at least it wasn't annoying. Treasure was about as balanced as it gets, which isn't unusual with Vogel's work. Unfortunately, there were no artifacts or really interesting items (something that I always hope for in a scenario). The Healing Tomes were nice, I guess, being strong full-party Major Healing items, but they're not something you can keep around forever, like a piece of equipment. There is, however, someone who will enchant your weapons to make them Flaming Weapons.
Although the characters generally didn't say too much, what they did say was fairly interesting, and often quite funny. From a gameplay standpoint, the dungeons were fairly well designed, but not outstanding. However, they were quite varied in style and usually quite enjoyable to explore, with Jeff's usual colorful descriptions and occasional tasteful humor keeping you interested. The biggest problem is, as mentioned before, the headbashing. The overarching plot was simple but enough to provide ample motivation for the party to complete the mission. The subplots inside the Run are also fairly simple. As I said, this is not a story-and-characters scenario and doesn't pretend or need to be. If you go in expecting an emotional rollercoaster, you'll come out disappointed. If you like to explore new places and see sights, you might enjoy this.
So of the three scenarios that ship with BoE, "A Small Rebellion" is rated the highest, followed by "Valley of Dying Things", and then "The Za-Khazi Run" dead last. I think it's telling that they're ranked the way they are by, and it's easy to see why this scenario gets such an undeserved bad reputation. The three scenarios each seem to showcase a different design style, each favored by different audiences. "A Small Rebellion" is plot-driven, with two possible branches, a lot of exposition of the situation, many people to talk to, and a few major, detailed characters that really drive the story. "The Za-Khazi Run" is exploration-driven and relying heavily on puzzles, with many interesting places to go and things to see and do. "Valley of Dying Things" is somewhere in the middle, with a lot of exposition and story in the above-ground first half, advancing the scenario without much in the way of combat, followed by the second half in which you explore a single enormous dungeon, with new surprises the deeper you go. If you expect them all to have the same style, of course you'll be disappointed. "The Za-Khazi Run", for its part, sets out to provide exciting adventure, and although it has its weak points, it does this very well and very enjoyably.
Therefore, I rate this scenario 8.9.
"The Za-Khazi Run" is a vastly underrated scenario. The reviews it tends to get seem to be like listening to Dire Straits and complaining that you can't mosh and headbang to it. The most active members of this community seem to want story and characters first and foremost, so when they see this scenario has only small traces of either, especially following A Small Rebellion which was heavy on story and characters, they blast it fiercely and frequently, probably scaring away many players who actually enjoy and perhaps would even produce scenarios like this. I feel it doesn't get a fair chance for what it is: a scenario based around exploring a scarcely explored cavern with new and unusual places.
I feel Stareye's observation in his review is backwards. This scenario isn't "a bunch of miniplots strung together to justify some wilderness gauntlet"; rather, the wilderness gauntlet and the simple mission are there mostly to justify the mini-plots, and to unify them into one scenario that can take a party from High to Very High level instead of having ten little scenarios that don't make sense without the context of the unexplored, dangerous territory. Furthermore, the time limit isn't meant to be terribly restrictive. If it were so restrictive that you had to skip half the scenario, you'd miss out on half the scenario with little justifiable reason. It's tight enough to worry the really lousy players who rest in dungeons and backtrack six sections to get things they missed (HINT: don't do that) and that's all it really needs to do.
The puzzles are interesting, clever and quite justified. They either serve to keep people out (why do undead need to get in and out of a crypt easily?) or as a right of passage (you know there are some incredibly wierd ones even in the real world, so I thought it was believable). Also, the headbashing was slightly excessive. It was worked into an interesting puzzle, but the most of time it was annoying. I had to use Magic Map once to figure out how to proceed.
Combat is typical 90s Vogel fare: mindlessly easy hack'n'slash. It wasn't challenging, but at least it wasn't annoying. Treasure was about as balanced as it gets, which isn't unusual with Vogel's work. Unfortunately, there were no artifacts or really interesting items (something that I always hope for in a scenario). The Healing Tomes were nice, I guess, being strong full-party Major Healing items, but they're not something you can keep around forever, like a piece of equipment. There is, however, someone who will enchant your weapons to make them Flaming Weapons.
Although the characters generally didn't say too much, what they did say was fairly interesting, and often quite funny. From a gameplay standpoint, the dungeons were fairly well designed, but not outstanding. However, they were quite varied in style and usually quite enjoyable to explore, with Jeff's usual colorful descriptions and occasional tasteful humor keeping you interested. The biggest problem is, as mentioned before, the headbashing. The overarching plot was simple but enough to provide ample motivation for the party to complete the mission. The subplots inside the Run are also fairly simple. As I said, this is not a story-and-characters scenario and doesn't pretend or need to be. If you go in expecting an emotional rollercoaster, you'll come out disappointed. If you like to explore new places and see sights, you might enjoy this.
So of the three scenarios that ship with BoE, "A Small Rebellion" is rated the highest, followed by "Valley of Dying Things", and then "The Za-Khazi Run" dead last. I think it's telling that they're ranked the way they are by, and it's easy to see why this scenario gets such an undeserved bad reputation. The three scenarios each seem to showcase a different design style, each favored by different audiences. "A Small Rebellion" is plot-driven, with two possible branches, a lot of exposition of the situation, many people to talk to, and a few major, detailed characters that really drive the story. "The Za-Khazi Run" is exploration-driven and relying heavily on puzzles, with many interesting places to go and things to see and do. "Valley of Dying Things" is somewhere in the middle, with a lot of exposition and story in the above-ground first half, advancing the scenario without much in the way of combat, followed by the second half in which you explore a single enormous dungeon, with new surprises the deeper you go. If you expect them all to have the same style, of course you'll be disappointed. "The Za-Khazi Run", for its part, sets out to provide exciting adventure, and although it has its weak points, it does this very well and very enjoyably.
Therefore, I rate this scenario 8.9.
#22 Lew Titterton
Posted 31 March 2008 - 02:47 PM
Lew Titterton’s Review
This could and should have been the crowning achievement following the decent Valley of Dying Things and the superb A Small Rebellion. But lots of little things hold it back. I give it an 7.8.
To shed light on that rating, let’s start with the plot...er, plots. There are a lot of them! The main one, of course, is the Sliths, which have been done to death nearly as much as the Vahnatai. There is absolutely no new take on them here...disappointing. No new motives (or any motives besides “Some Sliths just don’t like humans”) are presented. This isn’t really a plot hole, but it certainly makes for unoriginal, bland narrative. Other plots work to varying degrees; the lich adventure was quite well-done, if brief, and the giant vs unicorn part of the scenario was also very good. The alternate story to the unicorns, involving a maze of caves, was more frustrating than fun.
But the least successful element of Za-Khazi is the Vahnatai one. As I mentioned above, we don’t need more of this. Exile III beat everyone over the head with Vahnatai, and though they are a creative, well-crafted race, there is only so much that can be done in the world of Crystal Souls, waveblades, and the like. The light puzzle in the first Vahnatai tower is an utter pain, and the insane Crystal Soul is not much better.
Competing with the Vahnatai for the coveted “Suckiest Aspect of the Scenario” award is the ending. I assumed that if you won, you’d deliver the wands and assist in the battle against the Sliths, and if you lost, you’d find the place overrun. Well, I was right about losing...unfortunately, Za-Khazi is so easy that I had to deliberately waste time in order to lose, just to see what happens. In the two times I played the scenario (each different), I was able to win with at least two days to spare, and I hadn’t even been rushing. As for winning itself, it is a profound disappointment. Jeff is totally guilty of telling instead of showing — a crime in storytelling and especially in RPGs. The simplistic “You deliver the wands and the battle is won” message is a load of crap. If someone were somehow to make Ian Klinkhamer’s Heirs to Theseus the ending of Za-Khazi, you’d have quite a finish. As it stands, Theseus suffers for being only combat against the Sliths, while Za-Khazi falls short for lacking that combat.
Za-Khazi ain’t bad...but a Spiderweb scenario should be a helluva lot more than “not bad.”
This could and should have been the crowning achievement following the decent Valley of Dying Things and the superb A Small Rebellion. But lots of little things hold it back. I give it an 7.8.
To shed light on that rating, let’s start with the plot...er, plots. There are a lot of them! The main one, of course, is the Sliths, which have been done to death nearly as much as the Vahnatai. There is absolutely no new take on them here...disappointing. No new motives (or any motives besides “Some Sliths just don’t like humans”) are presented. This isn’t really a plot hole, but it certainly makes for unoriginal, bland narrative. Other plots work to varying degrees; the lich adventure was quite well-done, if brief, and the giant vs unicorn part of the scenario was also very good. The alternate story to the unicorns, involving a maze of caves, was more frustrating than fun.
But the least successful element of Za-Khazi is the Vahnatai one. As I mentioned above, we don’t need more of this. Exile III beat everyone over the head with Vahnatai, and though they are a creative, well-crafted race, there is only so much that can be done in the world of Crystal Souls, waveblades, and the like. The light puzzle in the first Vahnatai tower is an utter pain, and the insane Crystal Soul is not much better.
Competing with the Vahnatai for the coveted “Suckiest Aspect of the Scenario” award is the ending. I assumed that if you won, you’d deliver the wands and assist in the battle against the Sliths, and if you lost, you’d find the place overrun. Well, I was right about losing...unfortunately, Za-Khazi is so easy that I had to deliberately waste time in order to lose, just to see what happens. In the two times I played the scenario (each different), I was able to win with at least two days to spare, and I hadn’t even been rushing. As for winning itself, it is a profound disappointment. Jeff is totally guilty of telling instead of showing — a crime in storytelling and especially in RPGs. The simplistic “You deliver the wands and the battle is won” message is a load of crap. If someone were somehow to make Ian Klinkhamer’s Heirs to Theseus the ending of Za-Khazi, you’d have quite a finish. As it stands, Theseus suffers for being only combat against the Sliths, while Za-Khazi falls short for lacking that combat.
Za-Khazi ain’t bad...but a Spiderweb scenario should be a helluva lot more than “not bad.”
#23
S.M Adventurer
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Posted 05 August 2008 - 09:16 PM
Once again, I played this scenario many times before, but I didn't rate it. So now I will.
The Za-Khazi Run is a pretty basic scenario that comes with Blades of Exile. The plot? You must deliver a bundle of wands to Fort Cavalier through a labyrinth of caves and rivers. Now, there was not much technically innovative about this scenario, but they were a few things I liked about it.
The light puzzle in the Spiraling Crypt was pretty cool. The town design was pretty well done and there was good dialogue. The ability to steal the Draconian Scroll from Morog was pretty nifty. It saved me from going through some more puzzles. The test of the Giants was well done.
They were some decent customized graphics. Combat was nothing special. Basically much hack and slash. An appearance by Khoth the dragon was made. His role was basically to try to impede the party's process by making them waste time finding a valuable artifact for him. I had Morog's Scroll, so I didn't stop anywhere else this playthrough.
Oh, and the time limit didn't necessarily create any sense of urgency as has been said previously. I managed to finish the scenario in 8 days! That's just a little more than a third of time you are given! Perhaps the time limit should have been more strict. Like 14 days or something instead of 21.
The rewards at the end were pretty good considering the long trip. I don't see any problems here.
Overall, The Za-Khazi Run was a decent scenario. There are much better scenarios designed by other people out now, who have learned to do more techinically innovative things with the editor. This scenario may not feature advanced noding, but it does keep you busy. The scenario is decent, playable, and has good dialogue. It's not the best scenario out there no question, but I liked it.
My Rating: 6.4
The Za-Khazi Run is a pretty basic scenario that comes with Blades of Exile. The plot? You must deliver a bundle of wands to Fort Cavalier through a labyrinth of caves and rivers. Now, there was not much technically innovative about this scenario, but they were a few things I liked about it.
The light puzzle in the Spiraling Crypt was pretty cool. The town design was pretty well done and there was good dialogue. The ability to steal the Draconian Scroll from Morog was pretty nifty. It saved me from going through some more puzzles. The test of the Giants was well done.
They were some decent customized graphics. Combat was nothing special. Basically much hack and slash. An appearance by Khoth the dragon was made. His role was basically to try to impede the party's process by making them waste time finding a valuable artifact for him. I had Morog's Scroll, so I didn't stop anywhere else this playthrough.
Oh, and the time limit didn't necessarily create any sense of urgency as has been said previously. I managed to finish the scenario in 8 days! That's just a little more than a third of time you are given! Perhaps the time limit should have been more strict. Like 14 days or something instead of 21.
The rewards at the end were pretty good considering the long trip. I don't see any problems here.
Overall, The Za-Khazi Run was a decent scenario. There are much better scenarios designed by other people out now, who have learned to do more techinically innovative things with the editor. This scenario may not feature advanced noding, but it does keep you busy. The scenario is decent, playable, and has good dialogue. It's not the best scenario out there no question, but I liked it.
My Rating: 6.4
http://srmboe0.tripod.com/ - My BoE website. Contains my BoE scenarios and stories.
#24
Robsta
- Unspecified Services
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Posted 19 August 2008 - 07:58 PM
Za-Khazi is an OK scenario that lacks anything that makes it a great scenario. I presume what Vogel was trying to do when he made it was show a few of the things that a designer could put into a scenario. (Like Valley of Dying Things and A Small rebellion two showed). Za-Khazi therefore was an extremely different scenario than the other two, with an extremely different plot, structure and setting. The scenario however lacks the things that make scenarios great. It didn’t have any advanced nodding (such as animation sequences) that was developed later, by the community. It doesn’t have a great storyline. It doesn’t have artefacts, or any items with good stories behind them. It doesn’t have a restrictive time limit that challenges players (It’s been a long time since I played it the first time, but I think it took me 8 days). It doesn’t have a large custom graphic file to give it a unique and cool atmosphere.
Therefore 5.5
Therefore 5.5
I came, I saw, I conquered
#25
BainIhrno
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Posted 19 June 2009 - 07:01 PM
On replay, I thought it was decent. I thought it was an enjoyable linear scenario. Yes, I would have preferred to fight the Sliths at the end, there was a bug in the Spiraling Crypt that allowed me to skip it, and the 'heavy rubble' idea was just dumb, it was still good.
7
7
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